Hey Kevin,
The units I mentioned are supposed to be able to withstand a hurricane according to the manufacturer.
They also claim that cogging effect is proportional to the power generated, so cogging resistance increases with load on typical generators.. not on theirs. (again.. their claims).
Can you post a picture of your turbine set up? What is the optimum output of your turbine? What is the size, weight, height of the setup for comparison?
--- In electricboats@yahoogroups.com, Kevin Pemberton <pembertonkevin@...> wrote:
>
> Not buying it!
>
> I have had my anchored boat forced to port when my port mounted turbine
> kicked in.
>
> You may point higher into the wind with a turbine connected to a screw
> but you will never point into the wind and make headway. One of the
> discussions on this list many a time, is what kind of power will be
> required to overcome the windage of our boats. You are talking about
> adding wind catchers to your boat design.
>
> I do like the idea of help to keep the boat in place when serious
> weather comes along, so even if you are feeding the diesel to have a
> fighting chance that is a good option.
>
> A wise sailor removes the rigging when he is facing a hurricane, and
> moves his boat where wind is least likely... The reason? Even the wind
> against the standing rigging can mean disaster as wind has it's way with
> the boat. Put another way,/ "For every action there is an equal and
> opposite reaction." /I have experienced this many times on the boat. I
> have dragged anchor many a time because I wasn't in good holding ground,
> and the wind had it's way with me. Had I not had that extra wind drag
> called a wind turbine, I may have been able to hold my position.
>
> Many of the old water pump turbines like those shown on that site lost
> their lives in heavy blows because they were not turned out of the
> wind. What will you do with a vertical with so many blades in a heavy
> blow? All things made by man are compromise, and wind turbines are no
> different.
>
> I downloaded their "science behind" brochure. I found magnetic bearings
> that were not really magnetic bearings. All magnetic bearings I have
> seen required a controller to do their job. Cogging only quiets the
> generator down at startup, and allows lower speed startups, but no other
> advantage I can see.
>
> Summary:
>
> If every action has an equal and opposite reaction. Then 10 lbs of
> thrust against the hull in the form of wind will have to be overcome
> with 10 lbs of thrust against the hull from the other direction.
> Because we are using thrusters or other drive means to do this, we must
> consider the losses involved with the drive. Typically we are looking
> to at best 60% of what goes into the drive making it to moving the
> boat. We must now consider losses in battery charge and discharge.
> This is still much better than with an ICE but must be considered. We
> must then consider the efficiency of the generator system. The reason
> that a motor must be turned above the speed that it runs at a set
> voltage to produce power of that set voltage, is losses in the
> equipment. Now 100% of the power in the wind is not converted to motion
> in the turbine, and 100% of the power in the motion of the turbine is
> not converted in the generator to electricity. We must now consider the
> diode loss to convert the power from the AC generator to DC.
>
> My guess is 80 to 90% of the power needed to keep the boat stationary
> will have to come from an ICE driven generator and I think that is
> conservative. I found it difficult to keep my autopilot running on what
> my wind generator would produce, and that was pretty much passive
> control, go figure.
>
> Sorry if this is a little harsh, but I would not want you to spend
> everything you have to make a system that will not work, because nature
> is even more harsh than I. We just must live within the laws of nature,
> no choice.
>
> Kevin Pemberton
>
> On 11/09/2010 08:12 PM, Steamboat Willie wrote:
> >
> > I can only wonder what one of those would do on the racing circuit!!!
> >
> > For the rest of us, rags are probably cheaper.
> >
> > Willie
> >
> >
> > --- On *Tue, 11/9/10, Kerry Thomas /<kjthomas@...>/* wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: Kerry Thomas <kjthomas@...>
> > Subject: RE: [Electric Boats] Station keeping Azipod -- was Re:
> > Multidirectional Docking Electric Motors
> > To: electricboats@yahoogroups.com
> > Date: Tuesday, November 9, 2010, 9:17 PM
> >
> > Hi
> >
> > There was a catamaran here some years ago. Whangarei NZ. With a
> > propeller turbine directly coupled to the prop that could go to
> > windward.
> >
> > Also a similar setup in wooden boat magazine, on a monohull.
> >
> > *From:* electricboats@yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:electricboats@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Steamboat Willie
> > *Sent:* Wednesday, 10 November 2010 2:44 p.m.
> > *To:* electricboats@yahoogroups.com
> > *Subject:* Re: [Electric Boats] Station keeping Azipod -- was Re:
> > Multidirectional Docking Electric Motors
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Bear in mind that wind turbines have a LOT of wind resistance (you
> > don't get the power for free) and it will take more power to hold
> > the vessel in position with them running. But there has been an
> > idea kicking around for the past 20-30 years, and that's to have a
> > wind turbine connected to a propeller and drive a boat DIRECTLY
> > UPWIND... You might be the first!!!
> >
> > Willie
> >
> >
> >
> > --- On *Tue, 11/9/10, Galstaf /<richard@...
> > </mc/compose?to=richard@...>>/* wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: Galstaf <richard@...
> > </mc/compose?to=richard@...>>
> > Subject: [Electric Boats] Station keeping Azipod -- was Re:
> > Multidirectional Docking Electric Motors
> > To: electricboats@yahoogroups.com
> > </mc/compose?to=electricboats@yahoogroups.com>
> > Date: Tuesday, November 9, 2010, 10:32 AM
> >
> > To clarify: I am indeed seeking an anchorless solution, and this
> > is going to be a *non sailing craft* with 15-20kW of vertical wind
> > turbines. More turbines may be added later.. they are not nearly
> > as large or heavy as I had originally anticipated.
> > The Azipod does pretty much what I am looking for; I just wasn't
> > aware of the name. Ideally I would like that to be the principle
> > drive for the boat also.
> > Can anyone recommend a manufacturer for boats in the 50' (25000
> > pounds) range?
> > Is anyone using anything like this?
> >
>
> --
> Ubuntu10.04, Acer AspireOne, Virgin Mobile 3G Broadband2go.
> Doesn't get any better than this!
>
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