T-Pain Is On A Boat: Re: [Electric Boats] Re: Powerwall from Tesla, residential battery pack at $0.35/wh

Friday, May 8, 2015

Re: [Electric Boats] Re: Powerwall from Tesla, residential battery pack at $0.35/wh

That is good news.

/Jason

On 2015-05-08 10:55, Dominic Amann dominic.amann@gmail.com
[electricboats] wrote:
> That is a little outdated. There are a number of "pure" DC-DC
> converters out there. The 400V DC is a relatively new standard for
> Telecom battery systems (probably the reason Elon chose it), and the
> actual equipment runs at 48V. Therefore there are 400 - 48V DC-DC
> semiconductor based converters on the market.
>
> On 7 May 2015 at 22:03, Jason Taylor jt.yahoo@jtaylor.ca
> [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Whether you go AC or DC, you will still require some sort of
>> converter between the battery bank and the controller input. The
>> PowerWall outputs 350-450VDC. It doesn't include the DC/AC inverter
>> since you have the choice of 120, 240, single phase, 3-phase, etc.
>> Or, you could get a DC/DC converter to step the battery voltage down
>> to whatever your controller wants. But since most DC/DC converters
>> are just DC/AC/DC transformers, might as well just go straight to AC
>> output in whatever form you like.
>> So I guess, yeah, it probably makes more sense to look at industrial
>> AC drive systems.
>>
>> /Jason
>>
>> On May 5, 2015, at 08:25, Peter Gravel peterrgravel@gmail.com
>> [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks For that Hannu.
>>
>> For the many (I assume) fence sitters out there this is the kind of
>> news to make that final decision much easier.
>> It makes good business sense for Tesla to open up their systems to
>> business and industrial use, hence more and more systems will be
>> developed. Why else build this large battery complex?
>>
>> I'm wondering if, considering the Powerwall, it's more advantageous
>> to look at AC motor systems over DC?
>>
>> This has definitely convinced me to go electric (great news as my 35
>> year old Yanmar is getting way too old).
>>
>> Peter
>>
>> On May 4, 2015, at 11:28 PM, Hannu Venermo gcode.fi@gmail.com
>> [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Those batteries can deliver about 30% of the max load over 5000
>> cycles (vs 7000 cycles for Tesla).
>> So, your equivalent energy vs lion is == 30% x 2.5 kWh = 0.750 kWh.
>> Cost:
>>
>> This is actually about 10 / 0.750 = 13.13
>> 13.3 x 350 = 4666$ for a usable 10 kWh.
>> So, about a bit more (==20%) than the lion from Tesla (guaranteed
>> to work 7 years *in daily use*).
>> In *daily use* no std traction battery will last more than 3-6
>> years at best.
>>
>> Or, you can get about 50% DOD out of them for about 2-3000 cycles.
>> == 1.25 kWh.
>>
>> Lion is actually about the same cost as other battery tech, when
>> actual power delivered is compared.
>> At about 1/4 the mass and space.
>>
>> On 03/05/2015 02:01, billhopen@yahoo.com [electricboats] wrote:
>>
>> they are heavier, 4 batteries weigh 100lbs, that's roughly 2-3 x
>> heavier per Kwh as tesla....but who cares in a boat?,,you are not
>> going up hills, don't need a suspension and boats need balast
>> anyway.
>>
>> the big difference is price, my 4 batteries cost $350. total
>> (delivered cost) while my batteries are 1/4 the power...its 1/10 the
>> cost, that is 2.5x cheaper, and fifty volts is just perfect (and
>> safer in a salt water environment) I don't want no 450 volts when
>> a salt water wave comes in my cockpit, and I'm standing knee deep in
>> short circuit. I don't need an expert electrician to install them,
>> and I just need a $15 Chinese 3000watt PWM controller to run 50v
>> direct to my motor
>>
>> --
>> -hanermo (cnc designs)
>
> --
>
> Where there is a shell, there is a way...
>
> Dominic Amann
> M 416-270-4587
>
>
>
> Links:
> ------
> [1]
> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/electricboats/conversations/messages/26429;_ylc=X3oDMTJxaTdrbzZyBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzUyMTQzODIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1ODg0MDkwBG1zZ0lkAzI2NDI5BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3JwbHkEc3RpbWUDMTQzMTA5Njk2Mg--?act=reply&messageNum=26429
> [2]
> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/electricboats/conversations/newtopic;_ylc=X3oDMTJlMDliaDhhBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzUyMTQzODIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1ODg0MDkwBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA250cGMEc3RpbWUDMTQzMTA5Njk2Mg--
> [3]
> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/electricboats/conversations/topics/26393;_ylc=X3oDMTM2ODJyM2o2BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzUyMTQzODIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1ODg0MDkwBG1zZ0lkAzI2NDI5BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3Z0cGMEc3RpbWUDMTQzMTA5Njk2MgR0cGNJZAMyNjM5Mw--
> [4]
> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/electricboats/info;_ylc=X3oDMTJlMG03ZGRlBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzUyMTQzODIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1ODg0MDkwBHNlYwN2dGwEc2xrA3ZnaHAEc3RpbWUDMTQzMTA5Njk2Mg--
> [5]
> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/electricboats/members/all;_ylc=X3oDMTJmOTMzaTRlBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzUyMTQzODIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1ODg0MDkwBHNlYwN2dGwEc2xrA3ZtYnJzBHN0aW1lAzE0MzEwOTY5NjI-
> [6]
> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo;_ylc=X3oDMTJkYWIycWVlBF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzUyMTQzODIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1ODg0MDkwBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxNDMxMDk2OTYy
> [7] https://info.yahoo.com/privacy/us/yahoo/groups/details.html
> [8] https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/

--
Jason Taylor
--
S/V Fugu
1978 Beneteau First 30
Electroprop PM-20