T-Pain Is On A Boat: [Electric Boats] Re: Batteries, General reply note

Hi Scotty and others;

Part of the difference is higher frequency, and note "pulse charge" --
different from a "drag the amps out and see what happens" test. There are
also different testers, mine is the "drag out" type -- the one at the office
didn't seem to do that, but I was in a hurry so will ask next time I go
there. Probably costs a bunch, not Harbor Freight stuff. Time in use is a
better test in my opinion, as I said before, just like an oil change, tune
up, or tires. A cost of owning a battery powered anything.

Cal

-----Original Message-----
From: V1opps
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2014 8:32 AM
To: cal
Subject: Re: Batteries, reply note

Hum maybe I have a bad battery, but the voltage on all of them test good
And u say it's bad to put a load tester on them? I don't have a load tester
but maybe can borrow one?
Is desulftion have to be done with a 6v or 12v desulfator?
I have only seen 12v desulfators. Never seen a 6v desulfator. So I guess a
12 v desulfator can be used on a 6 v battery
From what I understand the desulftaters use a hight frequency hi voltage
pulse to desulfate anyhow
Thx
Scotty

> On Sep 30, 2014, at 18:04, "cal" <h20dragon@centurytel.net> wrote:
>
> Hi, Scotty;
>
> Batteries - of superior quality -- last longer -- even when not used.
> That is part of what you pay for, and get as a bonus. The long term
> charger, if ordered along with your own charging charger, work together to
> keep batteries at optimum strength long term. When the system as a whole
> is done, I advise a second charger that kept my battery pack good for over
> 7 years. I did not then have to trade off the batteries as often, just
> watch the use level, and all but one tested usable if not new, when I
> traded in the pack last month. Remember ONE bad cell stops a pack till
> all are fixed. However, I don't warranty the pack more than the factory
> does, with proper maintenance a new fresh pack may last say 7 to 10 years
> if cared for, making it way cheaper to own than off the shelf brands of
> lower quality. Or you can wait, pay maybe 40% more down the road, or
> some more even from me, as prices rise normally each year around January.
>
> Desulfinating a pack, testing with a load meter also takes a lot from the
> pack, how could it not, as it is severe cleaning and/or an active load on
> old cells. I do not desulfate packs any more, as not consistent, and may
> damage some individual cells -- that burn out in needed emergencies. I
> have what I use and add that to the battery order, by optional request, it
> would be tuned to match the system or if not doable I just don't order it
> with the battery pack. I have several, so no brand is offered, just that
> it will be for that pack -- or not offered if not possible at that time.
>
> I treat batteries as if my life depended on getting to shore and back home
> safely, without hassle -- some don't care and have to save a buck, I don't
> see it that way. When I had an insurance and securities agency, I sold
> insurance to a young man, "for his wife, if something happened" he
> cancelled when she wasn't around three days later. No fault, slick ice --
> but he ran into a tree skiing a year later, and the wife finds he left her
> and the kids to go home to her aging parents, also foreclosed on the house
> payments.
>
> Have a good day, ------ Cal
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message----- From: V1opps
> Sent: Monday, September 29, 2014 9:51 PM
> To: cal
> Subject: Re: Batteries, reply one
>
> Yes it seem hard to put a lot of money into something that I can only use
> half a year and they get worse sitting around the other half a year
> But my pack is getting old at 7 years and hard to make it up the hills, so
> not very useful especially in the winter
> Do you know if it is safe to put a desulfator directly on a 6 volt battery
> vs trying to desulfate them in pairs 12v? Last time I desulfated I did it
> in pairs but actually the pack seemed weaker after I desulfated them, ?
> Well congrates on making it to 75 hope you around for a bit more
> Cheers
> Scotty
>
>
>> On Sep 30, 2014, at 6:55, "cal" <h20dragon@centurytel.net> wrote:
>>
>> Thanks scotty, let me know if I can help others you might know on these.
>> If and when, I decide to fully retire, that's all folks --- at 76 next
>> Feb, nothing is a big deal.
>>
>> Battery power is provided by lead, or lithium, and other materials- in
>> acid- sealed or not. Different construction of course, but one thing is
>> constant in lead acid ( reasonable cost ) batteries. More weight equals
>> more power, lighter weight less power. Your choice as I mentioned, less
>> power for less $$ - or the other way, no magic there. lead ion costs
>> way more, your choice to spend more and get deeper recycling or not, I
>> have different types. However I don't use them, as all batteries lose
>> power over time, so I plan on a replace schedule.
>>
>> Thanks, Cal
>>
>> -----Original Message----- From: V1opps
>> Sent: Monday, September 29, 2014 2:43 PM
>> To: cal
>> Subject: Re: Batteries, reply one
>>
>> Ok that sounds goo but won't happen for awhile, I still overseas for a
>> mother month and head back over seat just after thanksgiving , so really
>> in no big hurry at this moment
>> Yea. I'm sure prices will go up in winter, but I'm in no big hurry
>>
>> I have heard some of these sealed batteries have less resistance and
>> preform better and last longer?
>> I have seen them in 12v only.
>> They seem to weigh just about the same as 1 6v wet battery so eve if they
>> saya 235 amps on them don't see how they can last as long as two 6 v
>> batteries that weigh almost 2x as much?
>> Guess carrying around less lead may make the car preform better ( a good
>> reason to go to li oin batt)
>> Cheers
>> Scotty
>>
>>
>>> On Sep 29, 2014, at 23:08, "cal" <h20dragon@centurytel.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hey Scotty, I think this will be a good buy on the ones for you, as a
>>> package price on the best and longest lasting batteries. Got prices
>>> this morning, and assumed your old ones in trade, since you can pick the
>>> new pack up at the DEKA warehouse in Portland. That way, no sales tax
>>> either. There are three levels for you to choose from, as you know
>>> probably best use is not to go too much over the 50 to 60 % discharge
>>> rate. No charger change on these either. Cash or deposit from you goes
>>> to my special "buyer only" account at Chase bank. All money stays
>>> there till you sign for delivery from my DEKA manager. Prices are as
>>> below, rounded up a nickel or two, don't need about .95 in every price
>>> on a list. Prices are not that stable for the season, as winter is
>>> coming so if you want these I have prices as of this week, maybe longer
>>> but I don't control that.
>>>
>>> Also these prices are confidential, just to boat guys or your friends,
>>> too much bragging might get this cancelled at the distribution point
>>> level, thanks a lot on that point. I can't let anybody know whose
>>> giving out prices on whichever brand, please note this, until I get a
>>> bit more business in place. Talking it up, by letting this be known it
>>> is a direct sale, could shoot this down for all of us. Please, only
>>> discrete inquiries by buyers referral at this actual sales point. I
>>> can't afford to have stores bitching to the factory for sure. Stores
>>> have shipping cost, sales tax, stocking and employee cost that I don't
>>> have.
>>>
>>> Series 10 215 AH ---- $ 119. List is $ 212.
>>>
>>> series 15 230 AH ---- $ 134. List is $ 234.
>>>
>>> Series 25 235 AH ----- $ 146. List is $ 251.
>>>
>>> That peels almost all the profit off for your pack price. I assumed the
>>> trade in of all old batteries. These new ones are in stock and fresh --
>>> so easy Portland delivery. You can arrange delivery through me if you
>>> need for that part to be a specific later date.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks Scotty, ----------- Cal
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message----- From: V1opps
>>> Sent: Friday, September 26, 2014 3:47 PM
>>> To: cal
>>> Subject: Re: Batteries, reply one
>>>
>>> I maybe able to get to pdx and pick them up sometime
>>> Won't be back for awhile anyhow
>>> Let me t
>>> Know the price when u get a chance
>>>
>>> Scotty
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Sep 26, 2014, at 8:29, "cal" <h20dragon@centurytel.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hey, Scotty;
>>>>
>>>> Hi Scotty;
>>>>
>>>> Haven't heard from Seattle yet. They want to talk with my guys, so
>>>> who knows. Two alternates, I can get the DEKA's out of Portland and I
>>>> think you can pick them up if I have them paid for in advance. Those
>>>> are the best. I can get the interstates here in Eugene, but they
>>>> might not get together with Seattle, and I can try Portland for that
>>>> too. Number three, since you save the WA tax, I can get them for you
>>>> shipped to you as sealed batteries, at added cost of course -- but a
>>>> pallet and shipping is not cheap. I will check tomorrow and try to
>>>> get some prices, by the way -- not doing this for folks who need one or
>>>> two batteries.
>>>>
>>>> I think this is best for about four or more at a time, so you have a
>>>> good number to work with as that evens out the freight, and overall
>>>> expense. I know most of this wholesale costs stuff, they would prefer
>>>> to do it on a cash basis, to lower their card expenses. That makes it
>>>> possible to lower the overall cost and still do a profit, could that
>>>> work for you?? All done at delivery at the store of course. You don't
>>>> know me, I don't expect to have you send anything to me first. Yes, I
>>>> expect to make a small profit from this, no surprise there -- but I
>>>> hope to make some friends in other boating areas at the same time.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Time to close shop for today, _____ Cal
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message----- From: V1opps
>>>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 7:14 AM
>>>> To: cal
>>>> Subject: Re: Batteries, reply one
>>>>
>>>> Ok great thanks
>>>> Isn't there a provision that for electric cars there is no tax??
>>>>
>>>> Scotty
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 3:27, "cal" <h20dragon@centurytel.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Looks like I can sell through the Seattle store, ---- if the store
>>>>> agrees tomorrow. I can arrange for you to get those batteries at a
>>>>> good price break. A new stock number, but better than the old ones
>>>>> with updated parts. Looks like 232 amp hours now, and they can take
>>>>> the cores without a problem, or extra $$ shipping. I will have a
>>>>> price once they agree to what we do down here, you will pay the tax of
>>>>> course.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks, ----- Cal
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message----- From: V1opps
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2014 8:52 AM
>>>>> To: cal
>>>>> Subject: Re: Batteries, reply one
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm not in town now, but would be in the Seattle area
>>>>> I think, if I remember right they are interstate u2200??????
>>>>> I think they are about 8 years old. They still work but hard to get up
>>>>> some hills
>>>>> They are in an 1981 ford escort...jet industries car. 108v pack I
>>>>> think
>>>>> Guess lithium would be best but not sure of cost and then need bms
>>>>> and charger etc??
>>>>> If I can find a cheaper alternative that's even better, some say SAMs
>>>>> club are the cheapest way
>>>>> Thx
>>>>> Where u located at?
>>>>>
>>>>> Scotty
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sep 23, 2014, at 18:22, "cal" <h20dragon@centurytel.net> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, I have access to, and can sell you batteries at an excellent
>>>>>> price, usually about what the stores pay to get them. I do sales
>>>>>> for Both Deka, and Interstate, plus usually have some special deals
>>>>>> on specific batteries as they are available. I can always beat the
>>>>>> prices, but often I can find some that fit the use better, run times
>>>>>> desired or more, using your input data.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Simple replacement first off --- What size do you have, and how much
>>>>>> have you been quoted for a pack where you are now ??
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Do you want more amps or maybe larger size, if you have space, or a
>>>>>> simple replacement ?? I have slightly taller ones that have a
>>>>>> common foot print, as good choices for you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Does brand make a difference, or is time the first line, like 3 to 4
>>>>>> years over 5 to 7 years, or longer, a choice of dollars over service
>>>>>> time ??
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Where are you located for delivery purposes ?? I can ship all sizes
>>>>>> by weight, only sealed batteries by common means.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If you need a new frame or fully rewired with new terminals, that can
>>>>>> happen, and makes shipping more cost efficient, as the batteries are
>>>>>> secure in that frame for way easier packaging.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With some data, we can find what fits best for the car, and your
>>>>>> needs. Thanks, ---------- Cal Drake
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message----- From: V1opps
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2014 3:33 AM
>>>>>> To: h20dragon@centurytel.net
>>>>>> Subject: Batteries
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi I have an electric car that now uses about 18 6v interstate
>>>>>> batteries that I am thinking about getting replaced, do you have any
>>>>>> good deals on them or suggest other sources or going to lion?
>>>>>> Thank you
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Scotty