Sandy,
I have to agree on one point, forget about pushing your barge very far on batteries. You'll need to configure as a serial hybrid and run a genset if you want to go any distance on electricity. You could also fit about 10kW of solar panels on it, which would reduce fuel cost but probably not eliminate it.
Although you might get as much as 2-3 mph in calm water with 200amps at 48V, the wind and sea will have its way with you at 10kW. You'll need to be able to bring about 50-100kW to bare on the problem if you want to reach anything close to hull speed and control the boat under all conditions so three 15kW motors might do pretty good except under the most extreme conditions. As long as you're not in hurry.
This would be a good applications for some surplus vfd fan or pump motors you might find cheap at an industrial auction. Maybe adapt one of your existing diesel engines into a genset and run the whole thing at a nominal 480V3PH which is common on industrial fan and pump motors
If you want to see the history of another underpowered solar electric barge check out http://www.archemedesproject.blogspot.com/. I can push the Arc realtime at 4 mph with the 80 amps at 48V I get from my propulsion array. More like 1.5 to 2 mph in any kind of seas but I'm glad to report that I've always been able to at least keep going forward and control the boat, albeit slowly, even under some fairly extreme conditions. However, it's nice to be able to switch back to the diesel and keep going 4-5 mph when the weather picks up.
Carter
From: cnc sales (hanermo) <gcode.fi@gmail.com>
To: electricboats@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2013 9:13 AM
Subject: Re: [Electric Boats] New member
To: electricboats@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2013 9:13 AM
Subject: Re: [Electric Boats] New member
I love your barge. Photos please..
Unfortunately, you have a poor system for electric drive due to the low power density currently available.
You have heavy displacement, (lots of mass and depth, relatively), and thus a relatively high power need.
So, if you needed say 20 kW of power to move the barge (reasonable, low end), and had a relatively expensive 20 kWh lion storage system (about 10.000$), at 100% depth of discharge the electric plant would only move it for one hour max (about 45 min real world).
Motor are easy and available from everywhere. They are also cheap and efficient.
Your energy generation and storage system is the key problem.
Motors can be sourced from electric vehicles, oem manufacturers or industry (servo drives, 3-phase motors, etc).
If you only want electric drive, and are ok with a generator, an industrial 50-100 hp generator is cheap(ish).
Motors are only a few thousand each, you could use 3-phase motor of 30-100 kW or any nr of these.
A VFD (cheap) will drive this with low losses, very reliable, soft start forward/back, cheaply.
I would use a 3-phase motor and a timing belt drive. They are 98% efficient, noiseless, dont generate heat, dont need precise alignment, and spare belts are very cheap.
Probably something like a HTD 10 mm or 20 mm teeth size, 25 mm wide, good for about 50 kW off the top of my head. Belts at 30$ each, or so. Buy a pack of 5 as spares. 2 pulleys at maybe 50$ each. OVERSIZE TRANSMISSION 300% for MARINE USE.
There are std tables for power/rpm/belt size. From Gates/sdp-si, whatever.
Last 5-10 years in industrial use, commonly.
A 2000-4000$ VFD replaces all transmissions, and costs the same whether 20-30-50-100 kW, almost.
In the US, cheap industrial VFDs, motors and generators can be sourced from surplus center (.com). Wiring is easy and cheapish.
Motors are a few thousand dollars.
25 Hp 3-phase, 699 $
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=10-2663&catname=electric
50 Hp 3-phase, 2395 $
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=10-2733&catname=electric
100 Hp, 3-phase, 1199 $
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=10-2146&catname=electric
You need one VFD of the same size for each motor.
It will cost about the same as the motor 1-4k$.
Unfortunately, you have a poor system for electric drive due to the low power density currently available.
You have heavy displacement, (lots of mass and depth, relatively), and thus a relatively high power need.
So, if you needed say 20 kW of power to move the barge (reasonable, low end), and had a relatively expensive 20 kWh lion storage system (about 10.000$), at 100% depth of discharge the electric plant would only move it for one hour max (about 45 min real world).
Motor are easy and available from everywhere. They are also cheap and efficient.
Your energy generation and storage system is the key problem.
Motors can be sourced from electric vehicles, oem manufacturers or industry (servo drives, 3-phase motors, etc).
If you only want electric drive, and are ok with a generator, an industrial 50-100 hp generator is cheap(ish).
Motors are only a few thousand each, you could use 3-phase motor of 30-100 kW or any nr of these.
A VFD (cheap) will drive this with low losses, very reliable, soft start forward/back, cheaply.
I would use a 3-phase motor and a timing belt drive. They are 98% efficient, noiseless, dont generate heat, dont need precise alignment, and spare belts are very cheap.
Probably something like a HTD 10 mm or 20 mm teeth size, 25 mm wide, good for about 50 kW off the top of my head. Belts at 30$ each, or so. Buy a pack of 5 as spares. 2 pulleys at maybe 50$ each. OVERSIZE TRANSMISSION 300% for MARINE USE.
There are std tables for power/rpm/belt size. From Gates/sdp-si, whatever.
Last 5-10 years in industrial use, commonly.
A 2000-4000$ VFD replaces all transmissions, and costs the same whether 20-30-50-100 kW, almost.
In the US, cheap industrial VFDs, motors and generators can be sourced from surplus center (.com). Wiring is easy and cheapish.
Motors are a few thousand dollars.
25 Hp 3-phase, 699 $
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=10-2663&catname=electric
50 Hp 3-phase, 2395 $
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=10-2733&catname=electric
100 Hp, 3-phase, 1199 $
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=10-2146&catname=electric
You need one VFD of the same size for each motor.
It will cost about the same as the motor 1-4k$.
I am in the process of acquiring a rather unusual barge, and considering converting it to electric drive if its not too expensive. I am still in a quandary however as she has two 85hp 900 rpm. Gleniffer diesels, and in the centre an 85hp Lister diesel. Dimensions roughly are 18.28M(60')x 4.34M(14'3")X1.3M(4'6)draft. Displacement I calculate at 91.54 Tonnes(90.04longT) hull speed 9kt. I reckon, and I will be interested in other points of view, to average 6.2Kph(3.4kt)(4mph) 59hp, 35.25 KVa , 44Kw. This could be spread over the three shafts at 15Kw per shaft. Searching for suitable motors is proving difficult and confusing. You observations and comments would be appreciated.
Regards
Sandy
-- -hanermo
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