T-Pain Is On A Boat: Re: [Electric Boats] Cost for Lithium vs Lead Acid

I purchased a used chevy Volt pack.
Pack kWh: 16.5 for about $1800.00

It is designed with 48 and 24 volt modules.
The modules are liquid cooled.

I was impressed with voltage of each cell when I tested the pack when I purchased it.
All cells were within .01 volts of each other.

I plan on testing a 48 volt module on my electric scooter and see how well things stay balanced without a BMS.
48 volt at 45Ah test module, the scooters original lead acid was 12 Ah.
I think the cells will not be pushed to hard and hope for good results.

If so, I plan on using a similiar design on my boat.
My boat is a modified 16ft hobbie cat.

Mark
--------------------------------------------
On Tue, 5/17/16, 'Myles Twete' matwete@comcast.net [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: [Electric Boats] Cost for Lithium vs Lead Acid
To: electricboats@yahoogroups.com
Received: Tuesday, May 17, 2016, 6:43 PM

I'd like to hear
an updated discussion of the cost differences between Lead
Acid vs Lithium.It seems the last
time I purchased flooded 6v batteries, they cost me about
$120 for 1.2kwh of rated energy storage---i.e. about
10c/kwh.Lithium costs are
high if you buy new. But some good and even excellent
quality Lithium cells, modules and packs can be picked up on
the surplus market these days at tremendously reduced
costs.About 2 ½ years ago
I bought my first 2 modules (3kwh, 42v nom (48 – 31v)
each) for about $1200 each --- i.e. 40c/kwh ( or 4x PbA
cost)Then 2 years ago I
bought an additional 8 modules (24kwh pack) for $6k --- i.e.
25c/kwh (or 2.5x PbA cost)Now, these same
packs can be had for as little as $4.2k --- i.e. about
18c/kwh (less than 2x PbA cost!)And this is for
probably the best lithium batteries out there---U.S. made
Enerdel modules.And that pack
includes connectors, some contactors, some cabling and even
Enerdel RLEC's (CAN-bus BMS boards for each
half-module)… Land-based EV folks
traditionally justify going to lithium based on "cycle
life". But that doesn't have a lot of value for us
E-mariners.Probably even the
most active E-boater with a significant size pack will still
only see 100 or less charge cycles annually.Even PbA batteries
can last several years or more.We hear 1000- or
2000- or even 3000-cycles (e.g. Enerdel ) for lithium. For
a daily driver, that's a good thing. For my boat? At
less than 30 charge cycles per year, it'll take me over
100 years to reach the 3000-cycle life of these cells on my
boat! Still, while the
huge count of cycle life for lithium is unrealizable for
most of us, the fact that a well treated lithium pack will
essentially outlive your boat is useful to know. How many
times would you have to replace PbA batteries if you used
those during the life of the boat? Twice? Three times?
Some of you out there are on your 2nd or
3rd pack already. Given that, it's easily
arguable that a Lithium pack that costs just 2x the PbA
equivalent is a bargain. And as mentioned above, they
aren't just "in the future"---you can get these
now. If any of you are in
the Pacific NW and would be interested in the batteries I
mentioned, send me a note offline and I'll point you in
the right direction---they're stored in Portland,
Oregon. NOTE: I have no interest whatsoever in these, just
know that there are some available. Anyway, I'm sure
there are lots of other options out there also. In case this
helps- -Myles Twete,
Portland

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