G'day jjoftheusa, All
At 12:16 PM 1/03/2010, jjoftheusa wrote:
>--- In electricboats@
>The hull form is incredibly like the original INCAT wave piercing
> > prototype (now sitting outside somewhere in Sydney, Australia) built
> > (I think) mid or early 1980's. That is about 25 foot, if I remember
> > correctly, so much smaller than this solar boat. .....
>
>Do you know where I could get line drawings or a table of offsets
>for "INCAT"? I would like to model a hull and run it thru a CFD program.
I know where there are models and the lines plans of the production
vessels, but they will be held commercial-in-
be available to release. Have you tried contacting INCAT and see what
they say? Unfortunately I've not been doing any work for them, so
have no contacts there (INCAT's home base is only a 2-hour drive away from me).
There are any number of 'photos of INCAT vessels floating around the
internet, but the original was far more rudimentary. I'll see if I
can find the 'photos that were sent to me and post them up somewhere.
It was unfortunate (from my point of view) that the AMC were unable
to get funding to ship the prototype down here, as it would have been
fun to work with them to do the river Murray project - we were
looking at 600VDC to 720VDC battery pack, industrial 3-phase motors
and drives (in order to swing the relevant sponsorship)
been geat fun, plus a trip that would have been a
never-to-be-
Regards
[Technik] James
Sunday, February 28, 2010
Re: [Electric Boats] Re: Star Trek e-boat.
Re: [Electric Boats] Fw: Friends in the DC propulsion industries.
----- Original Message -----From: marselectric1Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 11:52 AMSubject: Re: [Electric Boats] Fw: Friends in the DC propulsion industries.My side of the story:
I shipped Paul three brand new motors. I do not sell used motors. Our business model is to ship pallet quantities of motors to OEM's from our warehouse, and I only made this sale as a favor to one of my dealers. My dealer had spent three months designing Paul's propulsion system (down to each and every bolt, motor controls, mounting brackets, pulleys, ect.) and then Paul would not purchase by wire transfer.
After Paul received the motors from me, he claimed there was shipping damage on one motor, but could not send a picture of the damage. He did not claim the damage at the time he picked up the package with the shipping company. We (Paul and I) worked out a deal where I would sent him a new brush holder at no cost (which I did) to fix the broken terminal.
About two months later, he claimed to have used motors and wants me to send him another two motors free of charge. If I want the old ones back, I would have to pay him $350 in shipping charges in advance. He then sent emails for many months threatening to "slander" me (his words) if I did not send him new motors at no charge.
I do know know what he is up to, but I think he is "over his head". He is trying to connect a DC motors directly to a Diesel engine, and then to batteries. I do not think he ever purchased a motor control. If he ran the system like this, then he would have burned-out the motors.
As to the Mars Electric LLC business, we actually grew last year. We have a new 5 HP electric outboard with electric tilt, a new 10 KW continuous brushless motor for the Sevcon Gen4 control, and a 144 volt, 200 amps motor to convert small cars and trucks. I try not to post to this group because it is more of a "how to" group and we do not sell to the public. We only sell through Dealers.
John Fiorenza
President
Mars Electric LLC
--- In electricboats@yahoogroups. , "dennis wolfe" <dwolfe@...> wrote:com
>
> My dealings with John, the most recent being last summer, have been very pleasant. Maybe his business is going down the tubes too, like Kevin Plank's Re E Power.
>
> Denny
>
>
> ,
> Some of us seem to have had problems with vedours in the propulsion industry, here is a good one.
> I crossed the north Atlantic to the Azores mid 2008 without a motor and then decided on DC propulsion, being South African and my Visa only good for 90 days I had to go back and forth during the transition of getting all the bits and pieces together, Because I wanted to house a diesel generator and prop motor in my engine room space wise I could not go with the ready made systems on offer and decided to go it on my own. The particular vendour I was dealing with at the time was most unhelpfull and would not deal in US credit cards but wanted cash in his bank account before he would do bussiness with me.
> I then much to my regret around August 2009 ordered from John Fiorenza of MarsElectricllc three motors which arrived at the Marina where I am at, of the three one was new, two used of which one had a very bad burned commentator,bent casing and broken brush holder. John's answer after many e/m's of complaints was he will send me a new brush holder assembly which he did. I have written to him on numerous ocations that I was not happy about installing used motors in my boat when I ordered and paid for new motors. His answer to that was that his motors was very robust and if anything down the line goes faulty he will work with me, yeh like sending me used and faulty motors in the first place. He refuses to at least replace one of the two used motors and now no longer answers my mail.
> Last mail I recieved from him he refuses to make good on supplying me with used motors, so my fellow boaters be carefull out there.
> Paul Beaurain.
> S/V "CINDY"
> Azores.
>
[Electric Boats] Star Trek e-boat.
[Electric Boats] Re: Star Trek e-boat.
--- In electricboats@
.......
> The hull form is incredibly like the original INCAT wave piercing
> prototype (now sitting outside somewhere in Sydney, Australia) built
> (I think) mid or early 1980's. That is about 25 foot, if I remember
> correctly, so much smaller than this solar boat. .....
> [Technik] James
Do you know where I could get line drawings or a table of offsets for "INCAT"? I would like to model a hull and run it thru a CFD program.
Re: [Electric Boats] Fw: Friends in the DC propulsion industries.
I bought a five horsepower motor from Mars Electric a year ago. It came with a broken cooling shield. I reported it to them and within five days I had a new one. Mars Electric comes with my sincerest and highest recomendations. Thank You, Bob --- On Sun, 2/28/10, marselectric1 <marselectric1@
|
Re: [Electric Boats] Fw: Friends in the DC propulsion industries.
Hi John,
I made a lengthy reply earlier but it did not show up. Thanks for your responce, having worked retail and rental businesses in the past, I have a good feel for what transpired and where things might have gone wrong. One of my favorite programs was Paul Harvey's "The Rest of the Story".
I am new on the forum and do not know anyone personally, so I'll not make any judgements in either case, Hope you are doing well in your business.
Best wishes to both of you.
Ron
--- In electricboats@
>
> My side of the story:
>
> I shipped Paul three brand new motors. I do not sell used motors. Our business model is to ship pallet quantities of motors to OEM's from our warehouse, and I only made this sale as a favor to one of my dealers. My dealer had spent three months designing Paul's propulsion system (down to each and every bolt, motor controls, mounting brackets, pulleys, ect.) and then Paul would not purchase by wire transfer.
>
> After Paul received the motors from me, he claimed there was shipping damage on one motor, but could not send a picture of the damage. He did not claim the damage at the time he picked up the package with the shipping company. We (Paul and I) worked out a deal where I would sent him a new brush holder at no cost (which I did) to fix the broken terminal.
>
> About two months later, he claimed to have used motors and wants me to send him another two motors free of charge. If I want the old ones back, I would have to pay him $350 in shipping charges in advance. He then sent emails for many months threatening to "slander" me (his words) if I did not send him new motors at no charge.
>
> I do know know what he is up to, but I think he is "over his head". He is trying to connect a DC motors directly to a Diesel engine, and then to batteries. I do not think he ever purchased a motor control. If he ran the system like this, then he would have burned-out the motors.
>
> As to the Mars Electric LLC business, we actually grew last year. We have a new 5 HP electric outboard with electric tilt, a new 10 KW continuous brushless motor for the Sevcon Gen4 control, and a 144 volt, 200 amps motor to convert small cars and trucks. I try not to post to this group because it is more of a "how to" group and we do not sell to the public. We only sell through Dealers.
>
> John Fiorenza
> President
> Mars Electric LLC
>
> --- In electricboats@
> >
> > My dealings with John, the most recent being last summer, have been very pleasant. Maybe his business is going down the tubes too, like Kevin Plank's Re E Power.
> >
> > Denny
> >
> >
> > ,
> > Some of us seem to have had problems with vedours in the propulsion industry, here is a good one.
> > I crossed the north Atlantic to the Azores mid 2008 without a motor and then decided on DC propulsion, being South African and my Visa only good for 90 days I had to go back and forth during the transition of getting all the bits and pieces together, Because I wanted to house a diesel generator and prop motor in my engine room space wise I could not go with the ready made systems on offer and decided to go it on my own. The particular vendour I was dealing with at the time was most unhelpfull and would not deal in US credit cards but wanted cash in his bank account before he would do bussiness with me.
> > I then much to my regret around August 2009 ordered from John Fiorenza of MarsElectricllc three motors which arrived at the Marina where I am at, of the three one was new, two used of which one had a very bad burned commentator,
> > Last mail I recieved from him he refuses to make good on supplying me with used motors, so my fellow boaters be carefull out there.
> > Paul Beaurain.
> > S/V "CINDY"
> > Azores.
> >
>
Re: [Electric Boats] Fw: Friends in the DC propulsion industries.
Thanks for your answer John,
I am new to the forum and do not know anyone personally, also I have no reason to make judgements in either case, I have been involved in retail and rental businesses, so I feel the understanding of both sides.
I dislike using forums as a sounding board, so will not make any further comments.
Best wishes to both of you.
Ron
--- In electricboats@
>
> My side of the story:
>
> I shipped Paul three brand new motors. I do not sell used motors. Our business model is to ship pallet quantities of motors to OEM's from our warehouse, and I only made this sale as a favor to one of my dealers. My dealer had spent three months designing Paul's propulsion system (down to each and every bolt, motor controls, mounting brackets, pulleys, ect.) and then Paul would not purchase by wire transfer.
>
> After Paul received the motors from me, he claimed there was shipping damage on one motor, but could not send a picture of the damage. He did not claim the damage at the time he picked up the package with the shipping company. We (Paul and I) worked out a deal where I would sent him a new brush holder at no cost (which I did) to fix the broken terminal.
>
> About two months later, he claimed to have used motors and wants me to send him another two motors free of charge. If I want the old ones back, I would have to pay him $350 in shipping charges in advance. He then sent emails for many months threatening to "slander" me (his words) if I did not send him new motors at no charge.
>
> I do know know what he is up to, but I think he is "over his head". He is trying to connect a DC motors directly to a Diesel engine, and then to batteries. I do not think he ever purchased a motor control. If he ran the system like this, then he would have burned-out the motors.
>
> As to the Mars Electric LLC business, we actually grew last year. We have a new 5 HP electric outboard with electric tilt, a new 10 KW continuous brushless motor for the Sevcon Gen4 control, and a 144 volt, 200 amps motor to convert small cars and trucks. I try not to post to this group because it is more of a "how to" group and we do not sell to the public. We only sell through Dealers.
>
> John Fiorenza
> President
> Mars Electric LLC
>
> --- In electricboats@
> >
> > My dealings with John, the most recent being last summer, have been very pleasant. Maybe his business is going down the tubes too, like Kevin Plank's Re E Power.
> >
> > Denny
> >
> >
> > ,
> > Some of us seem to have had problems with vedours in the propulsion industry, here is a good one.
> > I crossed the north Atlantic to the Azores mid 2008 without a motor and then decided on DC propulsion, being South African and my Visa only good for 90 days I had to go back and forth during the transition of getting all the bits and pieces together, Because I wanted to house a diesel generator and prop motor in my engine room space wise I could not go with the ready made systems on offer and decided to go it on my own. The particular vendour I was dealing with at the time was most unhelpfull and would not deal in US credit cards but wanted cash in his bank account before he would do bussiness with me.
> > I then much to my regret around August 2009 ordered from John Fiorenza of MarsElectricllc three motors which arrived at the Marina where I am at, of the three one was new, two used of which one had a very bad burned commentator,
> > Last mail I recieved from him he refuses to make good on supplying me with used motors, so my fellow boaters be carefull out there.
> > Paul Beaurain.
> > S/V "CINDY"
> > Azores.
> >
>
Re: [Electric Boats] Fw: Friends in the DC propulsion industries.
My side of the story:
I shipped Paul three brand new motors. I do not sell used motors. Our business model is to ship pallet quantities of motors to OEM's from our warehouse, and I only made this sale as a favor to one of my dealers. My dealer had spent three months designing Paul's propulsion system (down to each and every bolt, motor controls, mounting brackets, pulleys, ect.) and then Paul would not purchase by wire transfer.
After Paul received the motors from me, he claimed there was shipping damage on one motor, but could not send a picture of the damage. He did not claim the damage at the time he picked up the package with the shipping company. We (Paul and I) worked out a deal where I would sent him a new brush holder at no cost (which I did) to fix the broken terminal.
About two months later, he claimed to have used motors and wants me to send him another two motors free of charge. If I want the old ones back, I would have to pay him $350 in shipping charges in advance. He then sent emails for many months threatening to "slander" me (his words) if I did not send him new motors at no charge.
I do know know what he is up to, but I think he is "over his head". He is trying to connect a DC motors directly to a Diesel engine, and then to batteries. I do not think he ever purchased a motor control. If he ran the system like this, then he would have burned-out the motors.
As to the Mars Electric LLC business, we actually grew last year. We have a new 5 HP electric outboard with electric tilt, a new 10 KW continuous brushless motor for the Sevcon Gen4 control, and a 144 volt, 200 amps motor to convert small cars and trucks. I try not to post to this group because it is more of a "how to" group and we do not sell to the public. We only sell through Dealers.
John Fiorenza
President
Mars Electric LLC
--- In electricboats@
>
> My dealings with John, the most recent being last summer, have been very pleasant. Maybe his business is going down the tubes too, like Kevin Plank's Re E Power.
>
> Denny
>
>
> ,
> Some of us seem to have had problems with vedours in the propulsion industry, here is a good one.
> I crossed the north Atlantic to the Azores mid 2008 without a motor and then decided on DC propulsion, being South African and my Visa only good for 90 days I had to go back and forth during the transition of getting all the bits and pieces together, Because I wanted to house a diesel generator and prop motor in my engine room space wise I could not go with the ready made systems on offer and decided to go it on my own. The particular vendour I was dealing with at the time was most unhelpfull and would not deal in US credit cards but wanted cash in his bank account before he would do bussiness with me.
> I then much to my regret around August 2009 ordered from John Fiorenza of MarsElectricllc three motors which arrived at the Marina where I am at, of the three one was new, two used of which one had a very bad burned commentator,
> Last mail I recieved from him he refuses to make good on supplying me with used motors, so my fellow boaters be carefull out there.
> Paul Beaurain.
> S/V "CINDY"
> Azores.
>
[Electric Boats] Re: Fw: Friends in the DC propulsion industries.
Hi Paul,
Now days there are many surplus dealers working through the internet, they buy merchandise from discontinued product lines, or bankrupt companies, I have bought many motors from these sources and they generally say if a motor is new or used. It sounds a little like your transaction might have been filled out of a group of these type motors, bought in bulk and resold through John. He should have disclosed to you that the motors were new or used.
I have bought quite a few from surplus dealers and have never had a problem. Check any of John's written statements and make sure he did not make any comment about motor conditions.
Best of luck if you continue on.
Ron
--- In electricboats@
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------
> From: Paul Beaurain <beaurainpaul@
> To: John Fiorenza <johnfiorenza@
> Sent: Sun, February 21, 2010 6:24:34 AM
> Subject: Friends in the DC propulsion industries.
>
>
> Hi Friends,
> Some of us seem to have had problems with vedours in the propulsion industry, here is a good one.
> I crossed the north Atlantic to the Azores mid 2008 without a motor and then decided on DC propulsion, being South African and my Visa only good for 90 days I had to go back and forth during the transition of getting all the bits and pieces together, Because I wanted to house a diesel generator and prop motor in my engine room space wise I could not go with the ready made systems on offer and decided to go it on my own. The particular vendour I was dealing with at the time was most unhelpfull and would not deal in US credit cards but wanted cash in his bank account before he would do bussiness with me.
> I then much to my regret around August 2009 ordered from John Fiorenza of MarsElectricllc three motors which arrived at the Marina where I am at, of the three one was new, two used of which one had a very bad burned commentator,
> Last mail I recieved from him he refuses to make good on supplying me with used motors, so my fellow boaters be carefull out there.
> Paul Beaurain.
> S/V "CINDY"
> Azores.
>
>
>
> ------------
>
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2701 - Release Date: 02/21/10 09:34:00
>
[Electric Boats] Re: Electric fishing boat foot controlled
Hi Mike,
The concept is so much like things I have thought about for more years than I like to admit. The price seems a little steep at $2495.00 being a DIY person, but then I'm not on the water much because all my time is spent working on projects that are never just right.
I did build a Six Hour Canoe in the past, after getting a book by Douglas Little, the Electric Boat. I took the canoe to the lake for a test trial (no electric) and swore I would never make the mistake again, fighting the wind and current with only a paddle.:) bought the batteries and min kota motors (two) but never finished the project:(
The point is, if one wants to go out on the water, it might be better to get a well designed boat and pay more, but everything works well and your having fun quicker and longer.
It is a nice design for what it is intended to do.
Ron
--- In electricboats@
>
> Thanks Ron for suggestions. I don't have that electric boat, but majority consumers have positive conclusions after testing. I hope that help you :)
>
> Mike
>
Re: [Electric Boats] Fw: Friends in the DC propulsion industries.
Some of us seem to have had problems with vedours in the propulsion industry, here is a good one.I crossed the north Atlantic to the Azores mid 2008 without a motor and then decided on DC propulsion, being South African and my Visa only good for 90 days I had to go back and forth during the transition of getting all the bits and pieces together, Because I wanted to house a diesel generator and prop motor in my engine room space wise I could not go with the ready made systems on offer and decided to go it on my own. The particular vendour I was dealing with at the time was most unhelpfull and would not deal in US credit cards but wanted cash in his bank account before he would do bussiness with me.I then much to my regret around August 2009 ordered from John Fiorenza of MarsElectricllc three motors which arrived at the Marina where I am at, of the three one was new, two used of which one had a very bad burned commentator,bent casing and broken brush holder. John's answer after many e/m's of complaints was he will send me a new brush holder assembly which he did. I have written to him on numerous ocations that I was not happy about installing used motors in my boat when I ordered and paid for new motors. His answer to that was that his motors was very robust and if anything down the line goes faulty he will work with me, yeh like sending me used and faulty motors in the first place. He refuses to at least replace one of the two used motors and now no longer answers my mail.Last mail I recieved from him he refuses to make good on supplying me with used motors, so my fellow boaters be carefull out there.Paul Beaurain.S/V "CINDY"Azores.
[Electric Boats] B2G TECHNOLOGY: IS THAR GOLD IN THEM THAR HULLS?
Well maybe not gold but, possibly some silver for those of us who own electric boats. Last week I was on an Amtrak train heading to Washington D.C. speeding along at 90 miles per hour (propelled by an electric motor BTW) reading an article about V2G (Vehicle to grid) technology. If it works for cars why not electric boats that are sitting tied to the dock with no one on them during the week. Capt. Mike |
[Electric Boats] Electric fishing boat foot controlled
Twin Troller is a good concept, but suffers from several design defects.
1. It's a basic pond boat with tunnels recessed into each pontoon. The tunnels start at pontoon bottom, rise 10" to accommodate the Motorguide 9" standard prop, then descend back down to pontoon bottom. That means all propelled water must rise and fall 10", using alot of energy.
2. Standard props work well at an 18" depth, but perform poorly near the surface, cavitating and ventilating. That's why there is no sound on their video. Standard props have only about 1/3 efficiency in reverse and make a lot of noise. Standard props have 4" pitch and will max out at 2.5 to 3 mph . . . no matter how small or light-weight the boat.
3. The boat is designed for calm fresh water ponds only. The cockpit floor is below waterline and is not self-bailing. If water comes aboard you must head for shore to bail. The seats do not retract to lower more stable heights, forcing a high center of gravity.
4. The foot controls pivot below the foot. Neutral is in the middle of pivot travel, but there is no adjustment for short or long legged operators. The foot is limited in pivot motion making speed and direction control very tedious and tiring.
All of these design opportunities were addressed in my Stream Dancer which won the 2008 International Concept Boat Design Award at the London Boat Show . . . but I have been unable to convince a manufacturer to take on a new project in this economy.
Meanwhile, I get calls and emails every day wanting to give me deposits for the first ones off the production line.
You can see my earlier efforts at streamdancer dot com. The boat now has taller bow and stern for coastal saltwater and more cargo space.
John Zimmerlee
404-394-6930