Tuesday, September 17, 2019

Yahoo Security Breach Proposed Settlement

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Sunday, September 15, 2019

[Electric Boats] Pearson 27 owner in New Jersey

 

I recently got a quote to power my Pearson 27 from Electric Yachts. they mentioned that there is a skipper who has a Pearson 27 in my state who has done it. I am just wondering if he/she is on this group.
I sure would like to see the repower job and discuss it with them.


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Re: [Electric Boats] Greetings! Catalina 30 owner here, considering an electric repower

 

That's 2-100 watt panels. 






On Sun, Sep 15, 2019 at 4:45 PM, bob jennings
<sabre281@yahoo.com> wrote:
I have an electric sailboat boat in Maine, Penobscott Bay area. It's a 28 footer & I'm able to keep the 48v propulsion bank & 12v house bank charged with 2-24v panels wired in series. I also heat my hot water with a 48v, 1000 watt element. I installed a 10kw drive from Thunderstruck. I spend most of the summer 8-10 weeks on the boat. The only time I feel the need the run the Honda is when I'm making my way up the Penobscott River.

At 3-3.5 knots I'm drawing 15 amps, 750 watts from the propulsion bank. That's 1 HP. Point being you may be able to save a few dollars going with the 5KW drive. If I had to do it all over again, that's what I would do. 

Bob


On Mon, Aug 26, 2019 at 9:35 AM, jasonsewall@gmail.com [electricboats]
<electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Hello electric boaters,


My wife and I bought a 1982 Catalina 30 about 4 years ago and we have had a fine time sailing it. Alas, around a year ago, the original Universal 5411 diesel engine broke down, and after what seems a very long time of looking at it, the mechanic says it's beyond saving. 


A used replacement diesel would cost $3k, not counting labor & incidentals, and a new one is over $6k. I'm not thrilled at putting in another raw water cooled noisy thing at such a premium, and we're seriously considering an electric repower for the next season.


We live in Maine, work full-time, and have a young family---we are day sailors for the foreseeable future.  We generally have used the engine to power in and out of the harbor and get canvas up. Of course, a bit of extra power for the doldrums & emergencies is a good idea.


We have a mooring (shore power is not something we have regular access to) and were thinking of a 10kW brushless DC motor & controller, etc, a ~10kw battery bank (probably AGM), and some solar panels to mount off the stern.  What research I've done suggests that this would be enough to get a few hours of power at ~3-4 kts every few days, which seems adequate.


So, I'm looking for advice if this sounds like a good plan, and for some tips about the size & type of solar panels we should consider. I'm looking at the 10kw brushless kit on Thunderstruck. I'd really prefer to keep the parts cost at $5k-6k, which seems like it might be possible.


I'm also curious about hydrogenerators; our mooring sits in an estuary that experiences strong currents at midtide and I'm curious if the prop as  genset or a secondary hydro turbine would be a wise supplement to the solar.


If we go this route, I would probably do some of the installation work under the guidance of a knowledgeable boat mechanic.


Thanks and I look forward to learning a lot from you folks.

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Re: [Electric Boats] Greetings! Catalina 30 owner here, considering an electric repower

 

I have an electric sailboat boat in Maine, Penobscott Bay area. It's a 28 footer & I'm able to keep the 48v propulsion bank & 12v house bank charged with 2-24v panels wired in series. I also heat my hot water with a 48v, 1000 watt element. I installed a 10kw drive from Thunderstruck. I spend most of the summer 8-10 weeks on the boat. The only time I feel the need the run the Honda is when I'm making my way up the Penobscott River.


At 3-3.5 knots I'm drawing 15 amps, 750 watts from the propulsion bank. That's 1 HP. Point being you may be able to save a few dollars going with the 5KW drive. If I had to do it all over again, that's what I would do. 

Bob


On Mon, Aug 26, 2019 at 9:35 AM, jasonsewall@gmail.com [electricboats]
<electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Hello electric boaters,


My wife and I bought a 1982 Catalina 30 about 4 years ago and we have had a fine time sailing it. Alas, around a year ago, the original Universal 5411 diesel engine broke down, and after what seems a very long time of looking at it, the mechanic says it's beyond saving. 


A used replacement diesel would cost $3k, not counting labor & incidentals, and a new one is over $6k. I'm not thrilled at putting in another raw water cooled noisy thing at such a premium, and we're seriously considering an electric repower for the next season.


We live in Maine, work full-time, and have a young family---we are day sailors for the foreseeable future.  We generally have used the engine to power in and out of the harbor and get canvas up. Of course, a bit of extra power for the doldrums & emergencies is a good idea.


We have a mooring (shore power is not something we have regular access to) and were thinking of a 10kW brushless DC motor & controller, etc, a ~10kw battery bank (probably AGM), and some solar panels to mount off the stern.  What research I've done suggests that this would be enough to get a few hours of power at ~3-4 kts every few days, which seems adequate.


So, I'm looking for advice if this sounds like a good plan, and for some tips about the size & type of solar panels we should consider. I'm looking at the 10kw brushless kit on Thunderstruck. I'd really prefer to keep the parts cost at $5k-6k, which seems like it might be possible.


I'm also curious about hydrogenerators; our mooring sits in an estuary that experiences strong currents at midtide and I'm curious if the prop as  genset or a secondary hydro turbine would be a wise supplement to the solar.


If we go this route, I would probably do some of the installation work under the guidance of a knowledgeable boat mechanic.


Thanks and I look forward to learning a lot from you folks.

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Monday, September 9, 2019

Re: [Electric Boats] Greetings! Catalina 30 owner here, considering an electric repower

 

Hi Warren,

Not sure what you consider a small boat, but I have a 31' foot O'day on a mooring. When doing the math (as I did) before building my system over two years ago, it seems like you couldn't possibly fit enough solar on the boat to effectively supply enough power. I was pleasantly surprised to learn I use way less power than anticipated. I have yet to draw by battery bank down to less than about 50%. I use the boat most weekends, sometimes during the week and spend 2-3 nights on board every week.  A typical day sail I use maybe 10% which is often fully recharged the next day. Every year I do a at least 2 trips around 45 NM miles and a few around 25 NM. I have only charged via shore power 4 times for piece of mind and every time I could have continued on without charging. I own a Honda 2200, which I have never used and no longer keep it on board. 

I have 460 watts of solar, on my Bimini and dodger. Totally out of the way, in what is otherwise unused space. While you can never have too much solar, this is really all I  need. My boat is usually fully charged whenever I head out. 

As for cost I spent about 13.5k all in. This includes new prop, shaft, drip-less shaft seal and a few other items not every conversion will need.  While I saved money doing the work, I didn't spare many expenses when it came to equipment. Yes, you could spend north of 20K paying someone to install. Conversely, i have seen people install perfectly functional systems for a few grand using inexpensive/salvaged components. 

I agree, the average life span of lead acid batteries in any application is probably 5 years if you are lucky. They are automotive batteries which simply are not designed to last long and most people don't care for them as they should. Honestly, automotive batteries are what has left early electric boat adopters with a bad taste in their mouth.

 The largest cost in my system is the 10kw lifepo4 battery bank. It was about 6 grand including the BMS. The cost of lithium batteries is dropping every day while their energy density and cycle life is improving. Today If I swapped out my batteries with salvaged  EV batteries, I could have twice the capacity at half the cost and a third of the weight. There is no reason my batteries can't last 10, 20, 30 years. 

Yes, I would be limited to 3-4 hours at 5 knots on a windless day. Keep in mind for every knot you slow down, you will double your range.. This isn't anything unique to an electric propulsion, it's a function of a displacement hull. Given the way I use my boat it's not impossible, but very unlikely I would encounter a day where I needed to motor that long without wind. I do end up using my motor 90% of the time while sailing to add an extra knot or two as its not usually as windy as one would hope. With a little bit of wind it doesn't take much power from the prop to add speed. It also helps point higher and help maintain course on a choppy day. It's true that in many situations, if i had a diesel, I would have arrived at my destination sooner if I had dropped sail and motored in. Now, I find myself sailing much more with the aid of my electric motor. Without getting too metaphysical and sappy, my boat has gone form two of the most disjointed power sources I can think of, to one of unity. 



Matt Foley 
Sunlight Conversions
Perpetual Energy, LLC
201-914-0466


On Saturday, September 7, 2019, 02:06:37 AM EDT, dynaform@aol.com [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 

Hi
While a electric drive sounds attractive, in a small boat on a mooring you will never have room for enough solar battery charging that will cost more than the motor install. Even if you were to install enough solar and arch?, lots of batteries ,and an electric motor it will only be suitable as an in and out of harbor slow speed auxiliary engine.5 knots max 3knts cruise.
It will never be suitable for say 4-5 hours of motor on a no wind day. ( cost of elec motor and install , solar , batteries $10-20k for sure)
Your best option is. Mount a new 10-15 hp gas outboard on a transom mount and regain space in the boat. Cost $3-5k. Go 6 knots all day long , easy decision. The new four-stroke motors are not that noisy and very reliable and require very little additional installation. They also don't require new batteries every 5 yrs, probably $1000 a pop! ( lithium would be 3 x your boat value!! )
Not the answer most want to hear but way more practical.
Cheers Warren

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[Electric Boats] Electric setup of Gemini sailing catamaran?

 

Hi, I'm a newbie to the group. Am considering re-powering options for my 34', 9,000 lb. catamaran. Originally powered by a Westerbeke 27HP with Sillette sterndrive. Currently powered by a Yamaha 25 HP High Thrust outboard. Westerbeke and Sillette drive have been removed. Both the Westy and the Yamaha push the cat at or near powered hull speed, about 7.5-8 knots.

Anyone with experience with e-conversion with this boat or cat like it? I'm open to both single and twin motor applications.

Thanks,
Allan

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[Electric Boats] Re: Hunter 34 Sailboat Conversion

 

The Hunter 34 would be well served with a 10kW motor for most sailors.  Not sure about the 2 X 1 ratio as it is the most common ratio but motor, propeller, and hull characteristics vary.  10kW should get you close to hull speed and with a well sized battery pack from 25 to 30NM range.  The 200ah battery pack will give you about 15-18NM range for most sailors, suggest you consider a 300ah as a better size.  Your solar would push the boat at about 2kts and doubling it is a good idea.  Good idea to focus on the charging the 48v battery pack and then pulling power from the larger propulsion pack to support off shore 12v needs.  Not sure what generator you have, but that generator would push the boat at about 4.5kts (it likely have a 5hp motor in it).  As for pricing, cannot comment of the DIY kits, but you may be a bit off as you get the right size battery pack.

Mike 
Electric Yacht Pacific

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Sunday, September 8, 2019

[Electric Boats] Bulk charging 48 volt AGM batterry bank with a power supply

 

Looking for some advice if it is ok to bulk charge my 8A4D 48 volt AGM  battery Bank with a new 48 volt 30 amp power supply that I bought. It worked great in my Electro Sailing tests. Now I'm wondering if I can use it to bulk charge the 48 volt bank since it has double the amps of my Zivan NG-1 48 volt battery charger. 


I plan to set the power supply voltage to 56 volts and bulk charge the 48 volt bank. I will finish the charge with my Dual Pro 4  charger.


The MK 8A4D batteries have a C/20  AH capacity of 200.

Any advice or cautions I should follow?


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Saturday, September 7, 2019

Re: [Electric Boats] Torqeedo 4.0 RL

 

I took off GPS cover to get access to the connection. Very poor design and replacement wires are expensive. Good luck.

On Sat, Sep 7, 2019 at 3:25 PM oak oak_box@yahoo..com [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

That's one of the FEW complaints I have about that motor.  On mine, the cable is hard-wired into the head of the outboard.  There was no screw connection.   The cable is not UV protected, so the outer shell breaks down in the sun fairly quickly.

If you discover how to open up the head and replace the cable, please let me know.

John

On Saturday, September 7, 2019, 01:06:20 AM CDT, Graeme Ross graemealross@gmail.com [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 

I bought an used Torqeedo Outboard. It has a remote throttle on a cable. I can not see where you attach the cable to the motor. It is a five post screw in connector on throttle wire. 

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Re: [Electric Boats] Torqeedo 4.0 RL

 

That's one of the FEW complaints I have about that motor.  On mine, the cable is hard-wired into the head of the outboard.  There was no screw connection.   The cable is not UV protected, so the outer shell breaks down in the sun fairly quickly.

If you discover how to open up the head and replace the cable, please let me know.

John

On Saturday, September 7, 2019, 01:06:20 AM CDT, Graeme Ross graemealross@gmail.com [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 

I bought an used Torqeedo Outboard. It has a remote throttle on a cable. I can not see where you attach the cable to the motor. It is a five post screw in connector on throttle wire. 

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Re: [Electric Boats] Hunter 34 Sailboat Conversion

 

Forget about the gas engine, too dangerous. There is a reason no sailboat companies put them in.
Depending on your use of the boat. If you only need 4 hours of engine use, then go electric. You can always use your generator if you need a longer motor time. If you are motoring down the icw, I would probably go with the diesel engine. 

On Sat, Sep 7, 2019, 1:19 PM jheape@gmail.com [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

I have to make a decision soon about replacing my Westerbeke 21hp diesel. I certainly will NOT put a Westerbeke back in, so it comes down to another similar size diesel, electric, or maybe even gas (which is doable and WAY cheaper than diesel). I have read most of the topics here and on the Cruiser Forum about electric conversions. I was wondering if anyone could offer some specific thoughts on my boat regarding an electric conversion. One advantage of the Hunter is that it is a very good light air boat, particularly with the tall mast which I have.

Hunter 34 specs

34' overall
28' waterline
11.5 beam
11,820 displacement
Currently has a 14", 3 blade Campbell Sailor prop
Have a 3650 watt generator
2 160 watt 12vdc solar panels in parallel
4 100 amp 12vdc battery house bank

I was looking at a Thunderstruck 10kw motor with a 2:1 gear reduction. 200 amp 48vdc battery bank. 30 amp 48vdc battery charger. Install 2 more solar panels (I use the solar panels as my bimini so have the room to mount them) and wire in series for 48vdc.

Looking at what others have described as their performance characteristics it seems I could motor 2 to 3 hours at 4 kts (with the diesel I usually cruise at 5 kts)  and use 50% of the battery bank if starting fully charged. I figure with he solar panels and the generator running I could double that time if needed.

Replace diesel with a rebuilt, about $6k if I do most of the work. New diesel would be $9-10k
Gas, about $3k if I do the work
Electric, about $5k if I do the work

Any thoughts, comments from anyone?


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Re: [Electric Boats] Greetings! Catalina 30 owner here, considering an electric repower

 

Please share them here, I know I would like to see what your experience has been.  

Thanks,

Dan Pfeiffer

 

On 2019-09-03 10:28, JD jpgroupfinancial@yahoo.com [electricboats] wrote:

 


 
Hi Matt,
 
I have a 1983 C30 that had an old atomic 4 in it. Last season I installed an electric 12kw motor. I have some good lessons learned and would be willing to share my experiences with you.
 
 image1.jpeg

On Sep 2, 2019, at 9:08 AM, Matt Foley matt@sunlightconversions.com [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 


 A used replacement diesel would cost $3k, not counting labor & incidentals, and a new one is over $6k. I'm not thrilled at putting in another raw water cooled noisy thing at such a premium, and we're seriously considering an electric repower for the next season.  AGREED, IT SEEMS ARCHAIC TO INSTALL A BRAND NEW DIESEL THAT MAY LAST 30 YEARS.. AN ELECTRIC MOTOR IS FUTURE PROOF. TODAY WE USE BATTERIES, MAYBE TOMORROW IT WILL BE A FUEL CELL BUT IT WILL STILL BE AN ELECTRIC DRIVE. BY GOING ELECTRIC YOU NEED TO KEEP IN MIND YOU WILL BE SACRIFICING RANGE, PARTICULARLY RANGE AT SPEED. BATTERY TECH GETS BETTER AND CHEAPER EVERY DAY BUT WE ARE STILL A WAYS AWAY.    

We live in Maine, work full-time, and have a young family---we are day sailors for the foreseeable future.  We generally have used the engine to power in and out of the harbor and get canvas up. Of course, a bit of extra power for the doldrums & emergencies is a good idea.

 

We have a mooring (shore power is not something we have regular access to) and were thinking of a 10kW brushless DC motor & controller, etc, a ~10kw battery bank (probably AGM), and some solar panels to mount off the stern.  What research I've done suggests that this would be enough to get a few hours of power at ~3-4 kts every few days, which seems adequate. 10KW MOTOR IS PLENTY FOR YOUR BOAT. I THINK 10KWH BATTERY BANK  IS A GOOD PLACE TO START BUT KEEP IN MIND A 10 KWH BANK OF AGM BATTERIES WILL GIVE YOU A USABLE 5 KWH. FOR THIS REASON AND MANY OTHERS ITS HARD TO RECOMMEND ANYTHING BUT LITHIUM. PERSONALLY, I WOULD ONLY RECOMMEND AGM IF YOU COULD GET THEM CHEAP AND ARE FULLY AWARE OF THEIR LIMITATIONS, E.G PEUKERT'S LAW.

 

So, I'm looking for advice if this sounds like a good plan, and for some tips about the size & type of solar panels we should consider. I'm looking at the 10kw brushless kit on Thunderstruck. I'd really prefer to keep the parts cost at $5k-6k, which seems like it might be possible. YOU CAN GO WITH FLEXIBLE OR RIGID, REALLY DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU CAN FIT WHERE.  I HAVE AN O'DAY 31 AND I'M ABLE TO FIT A TOTAL OF 460 WATTS ON MY BIMINI AND DODGER. ON A GOOD DAY I GET ABOUT 30 AMP HOURS AT 52 VOLTS OR 1.5 KWH'S. THAT'S ABOUT 15% CHARGE A DAY. ON A TYPICAL DAY SAIL IN THE BAY, I MAY ONLY USE 15%. I'M ON A MOORING AS WELL. I HAVE ONLY CHARGED AT A DOCK IF I'M ON A MULTI DAY SAIL..

 

I'm also curious about hydrogenerators; our mooring sits in an estuary that experiences strong currents at midtide and I'm curious if the prop as  genset or a secondary hydro turbine would be a wise supplement to the solar. HOW FAST IS THE CURRENT? I DON'T THINK YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO USE PROP. YOU WOULD HAVE A BETTER CHANCE WITH A SECONDARY HYDRO TURBINE. 

 

If we go this route, I would probably do some of the installation work under the guidance of a knowledgeable boat mechanic. 

 
 
 
Matt Foley 
Sunlight Conversions
Perpetual Energy, LLC
201-914-0466
 
 
On Monday, August 26, 2019, 09:35:46 AM EDT, jasonsewall@gmail.com [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 
 
 


Hello electric boaters,

 

My wife and I bought a 1982 Catalina 30 about 4 years ago and we have had a fine time sailing it. Alas, around a year ago, the original Universal 5411 diesel engine broke down, and after what seems a very long time of looking at it, the mechanic says it's beyond saving. 

 

A used replacement diesel would cost $3k, not counting labor & incidentals, and a new one is over $6k. I'm not thrilled at putting in another raw water cooled noisy thing at such a premium, and we're seriously considering an electric repower for the next season.

 

We live in Maine, work full-time, and have a young family---we are day sailors for the foreseeable future.  We generally have used the engine to power in and out of the harbor and get canvas up. Of course, a bit of extra power for the doldrums & emergencies is a good idea.

 

We have a mooring (shore power is not something we have regular access to) and were thinking of a 10kW brushless DC motor & controller, etc, a ~10kw battery bank (probably AGM), and some solar panels to mount off the stern.  What research I've done suggests that this would be enough to get a few hours of power at ~3-4 kts every few days, which seems adequate.

 

So, I'm looking for advice if this sounds like a good plan, and for some tips about the size & type of solar panels we should consider. I'm looking at the 10kw brushless kit on Thunderstruck. I'd really prefer to keep the parts cost at $5k-6k, which seems like it might be possible..

 

I'm also curious about hydrogenerators; our mooring sits in an estuary that experiences strong currents at midtide and I'm curious if the prop as  genset or a secondary hydro turbine would be a wise supplement to the solar.

 

If we go this route, I would probably do some of the installation work under the guidance of a knowledgeable boat mechanic.

 

Thanks and I look forward to learning a lot from you folks.

 


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