Sunday, March 20, 2016

[Electric Boats] EV Boats, Reducing personal builds

 

Over this spring I plan on reducing my "fleet".  One is a 12 ft. sail boat, centerboard & beaching rudder.  Two 27 Deep Cycles control a Minn kota 40 .  The motor is in front of the rudder, so it can be steered remotely from a center seat.  All steering, all sail handling, rowing, electric switching, is done from one place, no jumping around.  It is very stable, beaches on a flat bottom, and trailers easy.


Later I will have a 17 ft. garvey design to part with. Very comfy, sleeps two in the cabin, and space for lots of storage.  Side console with swivel bucket seats.  The whole cabin is removable, or just the center skylight, which allows for exiting over the bow even with the cabin in place.  Power is a golden motor 5kv unit, newest controller, complete dash instruments, foot throttle, water cooled, installed on a Evinrude 48 commercial lower unit, freshly gone through by a pro shop.  Swings a 12.5 by 12 pitch prop, brand new.  Before I got that big prop and Skeggard for better control, It made noise.  No more, new prop stopped that so well we can hear the wake bubbling, and talk in normal tones.  Batteries are 4 Interstate 27s, deep cycle marine.

Oh, yeah, if somebody wants a 12 ft. folding ply boat made for electric I have one that fits inside a Toyota bed and locks down.  Small motor hidden under seat, steers with the double paddle, battery under the seat.  Shallow "V" hull and will carry my 235 lbs plus more.  Goes together in 10 min, made it to keep up with kayaks when the wind picks up.  great little exploration boat, but needs repaint from leaving in the barn .

I'm working on another EV now, 18 ft. but need more room.  Decided to start selling off completed projects.  If anybody wants details I can be reached at  calboats@gmail.com .    I plan on taking some time to find a good home for these, just as long as the new one gets done before the others are gone.  There is also a mostly done and fast kayak, and I have an inflatable 9 ft. with light inflatable floor, beach wheels, and a motor mount that raises to fit -- spaced about a foot behind the solid transom.  That gives close to a foot more room inside.  The great idea for a dink, been inside the barn, so it doesn't get used, just dusty.

I can do some pix, if any folks are interested, haven't set prices yet either, as I need to do touch up and add a bit for whatever is needed.

Time to make room, eh --- Cal




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Posted by: h20dragon@centurytel.net
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Wednesday, March 16, 2016

Re: [Electric Boats] Re: catamaran built, 16ft power boat's electric conversion

 

2 options, perhaps, for making thin, light, stiff, strong structures,
fairly cheaply.

1. Torsion box as in doors, with 2 layers of thin == 3 mm plywood
expoxied together, on top level. Top skin 6 mm.
2 layers w. epoxy for rigidity.
6 mm total for puncture resistance.
The honeycomb makes the whole thing very strong.

Honeycomb == 6-80 mm thick. Bottom layer == 4 mm.
Iirc rigidity/strength is non-linear to thickness of honeycomb, its
either a multiple or a power-of.

Google it.
2. Optionally, use carbon fiber or FRP (fiberglass) for the skins.

On 16/03/2016 03:33, Mark F mark.internet@yahoo.ca [electricboats] wrote:
> Looking for light weight flooring.
> Plan to make it a 2 passenger with lawn chairs.
> Solar bimini and used Ford escape hybrid battery modules for
> batteries.(should be able to balance the weight of the batteries
> around the boat.)
>
> Mark

--
-hanermo (cnc designs)

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Posted by: Hannu Venermo <gcode.fi@gmail.com>
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Tuesday, March 15, 2016

Re: [Electric Boats] Re: catamaran built, 16ft power boat's electric conversion [1 Attachment]

 
[Attachment(s) from Mark F included below]

Test run for weight last year.
6x8 deck from used wood deck material(fairly heavy design)
4 passengers approx 650lb
minn kota 40lb with one group 27 battery.

fairly low in the water.
Actually moved quite well.

Currently rebuilding deck with used aluminum ladders for support(way less weight than the wood frame).
Looking for light weight flooring.
Plan to make it a 2 passenger with lawn chairs.
Solar bimini and used Ford escape hybrid battery modules for batteries.(should be able to balance the weight of the batteries around the boat.)

Mark

-------------------------------------------
On Tue, 3/15/16, rsandersemail@gmail.com [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: [Electric Boats] Re: catamaran built, 16ft power boat's electric conversion
To: electricboats@yahoogroups.com
Received: Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 4:51 PM


 









Hhhmmm I think once I get our Catana 42 rebuild
finished I might just be looking for an old Hobie to make
into a tender.









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Attachment(s) from Mark F | View attachments on the web

1 of 1 Photo(s)


Posted by: Mark F <mark.internet@yahoo.ca>
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[Electric Boats] Re: catamaran built, 16ft power boat's electric conversion

 

Hhhmmm I think once I get our Catana 42 rebuild finished I might just be looking for an old Hobie to make into a tender.

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Posted by: rsandersemail@gmail.com
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Monday, March 14, 2016

Re: [Electric Boats] Why gear reduction?

 

Open framed air cooled have their place. Part of my says that cooling if the motor is specced and engineered well should not be required. When I look at the air cooled enclosed IPM motor that Zero motorcycles use, their power output is impressive without forced cooling be it liquid or air. My personal experience is with lightweight low rpm/volt, high torque per amp direct drive motors as you know where prop choice becomes if you like the effective gearing to operate at high efficiency for the least cost and weight. To my mind unless you are wealthy one is better with a diesel when considering those criteria. As a low power sailing auxiliary then I think electric can compare well with limitations and of course the benefits such as silence when compared to diesel, but one power outputs go up much above 2kW then until Lithiums come down in capital cost (being the best battery for the job) we are it seems to me still in Tesla Model S land. Having said that I've enjoyed the DIY aspect of my build and the fun way you can build up a complete boat system in a modular manner over time.

Have fun with your builds, they are varied and interesting for sure.

John R

John

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Sunday, March 13, 2016

Re: [Electric Boats] Why gear reduction?

 

Maybe that's why Golden Motor makes them with water cooling, water pump inside the outboard motor housing, or could be inside the boat with hoses -- so do it right, for safety.  I don't think air cooled would be as good, maybe more noise – I can hear the water rush by the stern at cruise speeds on a 18 ft cabin cruiser. Johnson 50 hp OB lower unit.
 
Later,  Cal  
 
Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2016 9:13 AM
Subject: Re: [Electric Boats] Why gear reduction?
 
 

My understanding is that your efficiency increase is from turning a larger propeller at slow speed. Running a fan cooled motor at lower rpm reduces the cooling and may cause damage. Getting the most efficient prop while keeping the motor cool is the goal.

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Posted by: "cal" <h20dragon@centurytel.net>
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Re: [Electric Boats] Re: Efficiency Two boats, testing -- or similar !!

 

I guess I am going that way, two identical drives, one heavy boat runs great, newer one at 1/2 the weight and same power, batts.  Cruise, (forgot GPS!) is about a brisk jog, figure 5 hrs. at 20 ish amps, conservatively.  Will publish more when done and have both on the water at the same time.  Not exact of course, but could provide interesting data concerning weight and hull shapes.  This all by accident of buying two power kits, and being a boat builder, building boats designed to be EV efficient is great fun.
 
later,  Cal
 
Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2016 9:57 AM
Subject: [Electric Boats] Re: Efficiency
 
 

I believe your challenge to be somewhat unreasonable - who has two boats (or two drive systems) to dedicate to proving what they think they already know?

 
Something you have not thought about, is that resistance goes up rapidly with a rise in temperature, and temperature goes up with current, All things being equal, if your system uses a lower voltage to produce a similar power, it will draw more current, and run hotter. It will then be necessarily less efficient since it is wasting electricity to produce heat (which increases resistance, sometimes in a deadly run away effect).
 
Although electric motors produce decent torque at low RPM, they will run hot doing so. Your motor is rated at a certain continuous current based on its "ideal" RPM - in other words, its ideal effective voltage. Running the motor outside its sweet spot in terms of RPM for long periods will result in greater heat generation, and lowered efficiency.
 

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Posted by: "cal" <h20dragon@centurytel.net>
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