Friday, June 8, 2018

Re: [Electric Boats] Project lagoon 410

 

Higher voltage is better.
More modern controllers are better.

More energy dense motive battery cells/modules are better.

Everything depends and "better" is relative.

On 06/06/2018 03:22, squalmail@gmail.com [electricboats] wrote:
>
> Hello
>
>
> I would to change my olds yanmar 3GM30 (27hp) on my catamaran lagoon
> 410 (1998) by electric solution.
>
> Who can help me to find the best and inexpensive solution, please.
>
> Best regards
>
> Pascal Morin
> Guadeloupe
>

--
-hanermo (cnc designs)

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Posted by: Hannu Venermo <gcode.fi@gmail.com>
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Thursday, June 7, 2018

Re: [Electric Boats] Re: Project lagoon 410

 

Hi
Thank you. Sorry I have lot of questions.
What's the power of your electrics motors and how many amp in your battery bank?
How many time in motor sailing mode
Do you Regen when wind sailing?

Best regards
Pascal

Cordialement
Pascal et Emilie
0690207491
From: electricboats@yahoogroups.com <electricboats@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of GMcG grahammcglashan@gmail.com [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 7, 2018 11:42:15 AM
To: electricboats@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Electric Boats] Re: Project lagoon 410
 
 

Pascal,
My Farrier F-41 has Sillette sail drives, which were fitted to Electric Yacht 48v. systems.
I use Thundersky lithium batteries, and have no battery balancing system. Monitoring only. We just check individual module voltage occasionally.
Check out the 'Lithium batteries for use in house banks' on Cruisers Forum for the care and feeding of a Lithium bank.
Very happy with performance. We use Kiwi feathering props.
System is light weight and simple.
Bon chance.
Graham

Sent from my iPad

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Posted by: Pascal MORIN <squalmail@gmail.com>
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[Electric Boats] Re: Project lagoon 410

 

Pascal,
My Farrier F-41 has Sillette sail drives, which were fitted to Electric Yacht 48v. systems.
I use Thundersky lithium batteries, and have no battery balancing system. Monitoring only. We just check individual module voltage occasionally.
Check out the 'Lithium batteries for use in house banks' on Cruisers Forum for the care and feeding of a Lithium bank.
Very happy with performance. We use Kiwi feathering props.
System is light weight and simple.
Bon chance.
Graham

Sent from my iPad

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Posted by: GMcG <grahammcglashan@gmail.com>
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Wednesday, June 6, 2018

[Electric Boats] Re: Project lagoon 410

 

I believe that the Lagoon 410 has Yanmar saildrives.  My recommendation would be to replace both the motor and saildrive as the most prudent way to go. Yanmar saildrives from that era are known to have issues.  You would be well served with two 20kW electric motors to replace the 35-40hp diesels originally installed by the builder.  They would also be well matched with a single 10 to 15kW generator that would provide range extension, reduce battery weight, and support reasonable cruising speed.

I am not fully up to date on all saildrive options, but would think you should look at these vendors: Electric Yacht, OceanVolt, and Torqeedo for marine grade systems.  There may be others that I am not aware of. 

Mike
Electric Yacht Pacific

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Posted by: mike@electricyachtssocal.com
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RE: [Electric Boats] Project lagoon 410

 

So the story goes….

Lagoon was approached by Solomons Tech back in the early 2000's to install their system in the 410. The boats performed great even with the 12 lead acid batteries Lagoon provided. Then there was a shake up at Solomons and this gave Lagoon the opportunity to dump Solomons and go their own way. Solomons system was based on a 144V which went on to be installed in such manufactures as GunBoat and other smaller production boat manufactures. Lagoon decided that they were going to run a 72V system in the new 420, make it a fully automatic system and market it to the charter companies in the Carib. Well this didn't go as planned. Renters (who tend to motor more than sail) were burning up the propulsion packs, the Auto system didn't work right, and the Management companies down there didn't have the tech to fix them so they kept on breaking. The stock Lead acid batteries where failing do to the high cycle rate as well. To go along with this the 420 hull was designed around the batteries, wider and flatter. This didn't help the sailing ability so it was deemed a slow boat.  The owners (those that put them in charter) of the boats were not happy, charter companies weren't happy, so Lagoon offered to retro fit the 420 with dyno motors. This got a really bad rap for Lagoon so no new boats were ever offered Electric. I have heard that there is a 440 and I think a 450 that are electric but don't think they are factory, Probably a Solomons retro fit.  

As far as saildirves go I would get rid of it and go with a shaft. I've never heard anything good about saildrives and the amount of maintenance required (my opinion). A straight shaft is simple and requires minimum maintenance as well as simplicity to install electric drives.

 

Steve in Solomons MD

Lagoon 410 SE

 

 

From: electricboats@yahoogroups.com <electricboats@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 10:06 AM
To: electricboats@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Electric Boats] Project lagoon 410

 




Hi Steve

 

Thank for your message.

I heard about electric lagoon and the owners handed over diesel engines. What is the reason for this failure?
I'm sailing always with the wind, in the Caribbean, and i use engine only to go in or out marina or moorings. on rare exception i use engine when there is no wind.
I have solar panel (300w) and a D400 aerogen. I would like to exploit the regeneration under sail and put additional solar panels eventually.
I understand that a genset for security is necessary but i would like never use. My first idea is 10kw brushless (my wife said why not a 20kw), controller with regen fonction, and before reading you and 144V  I would 42V battery, type of battery not decided cause the price for now.
a problem for me to solve is how to put the electric motor on the SD20 saildrive?
Pascal
Guadeloupe
 

 

 

2018-06-06 8:46 GMT-04:00 'Steve Dolan' sdolan@scannersllc.com [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com>:

 

[Attachment(s) from Steve Dolan included below]

Pascal,

I have 1 of the 3 Lagoon (2004) 410's built with Electric drives.

The system is no longer produced as a "kit" from Solomons Technologies but if there is anything I can help with just ask. I'm running LiPo4 batteries from CALB and a 144V system which I couldn't be happier with.. Here are a few things to consider.

Your going to need a 21KW GenSet for extended run times. This is enough AMPS to not only run at full speed under the genset but also charge the battery Pack at the same time.

With the LiPo4'S you will need a BMS. I'm using the ORION BMS with the Andromeda Display at the helm to monitor the batteries and motors.

Attached is a general system layout.

The ST74 motors put out 12HP per side. I do 6 to 7 knots.

In general a system like mine would run around $40K.

 

So it's not the least expensive system out there, I'm sure there are a few others that may be cheaper however I would go 144V for the low amp draw.

 

Hope that helps,

 

Steve in Solomon MD

Lagoon 410 SE

 

 



Hello

 

I would to change my olds yanmar 3GM30 (27hp) on my catamaran lagoon 410 (1998) by electric solution.

 

Who can help me to find the best and inexpensive solution, please.

 

Best regards

 

Pascal Morin

Guadeloupe

 



 




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Posted by: "Steve Dolan" <sdolan@scannersllc.com>
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Re: [Electric Boats] Project lagoon 410

 

Hi Steve

Thank for your message.
I heard about electric lagoon and the owners handed over diesel engines. What is the reason for this failure?
I'm sailing always with the wind, in the Caribbean, and i use engine only to go in or out marina or moorings. on rare exception i use engine when there is no wind.
I have solar panel (300w) and a D400 aerogen. I would like to exploit the regeneration under sail and put additional solar panels eventually.
I understand that a genset for security is necessary but i would like never use. My first idea is 10kw brushless (my wife said why not a 20kw), controller with regen fonction, and before reading you and 144V  I would 42V battery, type of battery not decided cause the price for now.
a problem for me to solve is how to put the electric motor on the SD20 saildrive?
Pascal
Guadeloupe


2018-06-06 8:46 GMT-04:00 'Steve Dolan' sdolan@scannersllc.com [electricboats] <electricboats@yahoogroups.com>:
 
[Attachment(s) from Steve Dolan included below]

Pascal,

I have 1 of the 3 Lagoon (2004) 410's built with Electric drives.

The system is no longer produced as a "kit" from Solomons Technologies but if there is anything I can help with just ask. I'm running LiPo4 batteries from CALB and a 144V system which I couldn't be happier with.. Here are a few things to consider.

Your going to need a 21KW GenSet for extended run times. This is enough AMPS to not only run at full speed under the genset but also charge the battery Pack at the same time.

With the LiPo4'S you will need a BMS. I'm using the ORION BMS with the Andromeda Display at the helm to monitor the batteries and motors.

Attached is a general system layout.

The ST74 motors put out 12HP per side. I do 6 to 7 knots.

In general a system like mine would run around $40K.

 

So it's not the least expensive system out there, I'm sure there are a few others that may be cheaper however I would go 144V for the low amp draw.

 

Hope that helps,

 

Steve in Solomon MD

Lagoon 410 SE

 

 



Hello

 

I would to change my olds yanmar 3GM30 (27hp) on my catamaran lagoon 410 (1998) by electric solution.

 

Who can help me to find the best and inexpensive solution, please.

 

Best regards

 

Pascal Morin

Guadeloupe

 





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Posted by: Pascal MORIN <squalmail@gmail.com>
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.

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RE: [Electric Boats] Project lagoon 410 [1 Attachment]

 
[Attachment(s) from Steve Dolan included below]

Pascal,

I have 1 of the 3 Lagoon (2004) 410's built with Electric drives.

The system is no longer produced as a "kit" from Solomons Technologies but if there is anything I can help with just ask. I'm running LiPo4 batteries from CALB and a 144V system which I couldn't be happier with.. Here are a few things to consider.

Your going to need a 21KW GenSet for extended run times. This is enough AMPS to not only run at full speed under the genset but also charge the battery Pack at the same time.

With the LiPo4'S you will need a BMS. I'm using the ORION BMS with the Andromeda Display at the helm to monitor the batteries and motors.

Attached is a general system layout.

The ST74 motors put out 12HP per side. I do 6 to 7 knots.

In general a system like mine would run around $40K.

 

So it's not the least expensive system out there, I'm sure there are a few others that may be cheaper however I would go 144V for the low amp draw.

 

Hope that helps,

 

Steve in Solomon MD

Lagoon 410 SE

 

 



Hello

 

I would to change my olds yanmar 3GM30 (27hp) on my catamaran lagoon 410 (1998) by electric solution.

 

Who can help me to find the best and inexpensive solution, please.

 

Best regards

 

Pascal Morin

Guadeloupe

 




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Attachment(s) from Steve Dolan | View attachments on the web

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Posted by: "Steve Dolan" <sdolan@scannersllc.com>
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.

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